What kind of words someone use?

[donq]

The Yi Jing/Zhouyi ("Book of Changes" or "Classic of Changes" (often spelled I Ching) is the oldest of the Chinese classic texts, describing an ancient system of cosmology, philosophy and divination. The text has existed for over two thousand years.

As written Chinese is a pictograph, it’s very hard to understand/interpret (especially an ancient Chinese) even among nowadays Chinese themselves. The passage below is from Ta Chuan: The Great Treatise, a Commentary on the I Ching. Richard Wilhelm translated it from Chinese into German, then Cary F. Baynes into English. (As for James Legge, only from Chinese into English.)

I’ve always been fascinated by its text for so many years. And you can see my point now. As English is not my first language, not to mention it was translated from another one or two language (s), I have no way to be sure if it’s the right word or not. Even I might misinterpret it a bit, but I've found that this text is so true to understand someone from the kind of words they use.

I appreciate any thought from you. Thanks.

The words of a man who plans revolt are confused.
The words of a man who entertains doubt in his inmost heart are ramified.
The words of men of good fortune are few.
Excited men use many words.
Slanderers of good men are roundabout in their words.
The words of a man who has lost his standpoint are twisted.

- Richard Wilhelm/Cary F. Baynes

The language of him who is meditating a revolt (from the right) betrays his inward shame;
that of him whose inward heart doubts about it diverges to other topics.
The words of a good man are few;
those of a coarse man are many.
The words of one who slanders what is good are unsubstantial;
those of him who is losing what he ought to keep are crooked.

- James Legge

[donq]

There’s Thai saying, “An axe can chip anything but its handle.”
So let’s start making a point from how I used my word in my previous post.

One thing for sure is, it was not the words of good fortune, as I used many words, not just few.
Neither did the words of slanderers of good men. Come on, I didn’t slander anyone, did I?
Yes, my words might be confused. It seems I was presenting some revolt idea? But...but, at least it was not my own words, but the words from I Ching. Agree?
And yes, I had some doubt in my mind, that was why my words are ramified.
As for twist, it should not be. I think I have had my firm standpoint about this topic.

[sparklekaz]

Hi Monty,

An interesting post. I have noticed that the man who listens, chooses their words with care and speaks simply from the heart. The men/women who listen more then they speak, when they choose to speak are then listened to the most attentively, and their words tend to have the most impact.

I am one of those excitable types, who does tend to use too many words sometimes lol. If I am confused in my thoughts, that conveys itself into my text. I over do it usually, or try to cram to many variables, intending to offer the reader different perspectives, which can sometimes read in a contradictive way. I don't think I do myself any favours though with that.

When I am firm in my standpoint, I have to watch that I don't come over as preachy. Having conviction and self belief in what you think is good. But can come over as stating it as a fact. When it is simply a personal view point. I try to watch myself in this.

Nice post and one which I think will make other's think, about how their state of mind and personality influences the way in which they share information and articulate their thoughts.

Love and light
Kaz

[aceofcups]

Hi Monty,,,

nice post,, like what you and Kaz wrote
decided to take the above texts and reword them in my own words and understanding as an exercise.

The words of a person who plans a revolt are usually angered and ego driven.
The words of a person who entertains doubt, has low self esteem and not aligned to their higher.
The words of a person of good fortune is reaping what they sowed.
Excited people use to many words in a short time span , activated by a racing mind.
Slanderers of good people, will eventually receive what they give out.
The words of a person who has lost their center are reflected in what they give forth.

The words of a truly connected /compasionate person are few
and likewise filled with the Essence of Silence.


peace
Aceofcups

[donq]

Hi ace,

Wow! Good one. Thanks.

Yes, you and kaz really got what I asked. This is about noticing the state of mind on verbal expression (including our own words we are using.)
I know there’s also an exception (for example, psychopath etc.) We have no way to know their states of mind via their verbal expressions.

Someone said Richard Wilhelm’s I Ching, though still one of the best versions, is a bit wordy. I don’t know. (I have more than 70 “books” of I Ching.) But I like what Cary F. Baynes rendered into English. She used only compact words and so powerful. Yes, this might be too "open" to misread/misinterpret. But I have a feeling that it was so close to ancient Chinese pictograph. Then, again, English is not my first language. lol