Free will.

[mojomojo]

There are many things to do with spirituality that do not sit right, and no matter how many attempts to push to the back of the mind, it keeps resurfacing like an irritable itch, that just doesn't want to right itself.
It is on account of the continuous resurfacing, the conclusion is drawn, that something is not correct.
 One of these is free will, it is claimed that man has free will, which is reinforced by the idea that spirit guides or guardian angels can not intervene, unless asked, thus respecting our free will.

But yet, there seems, when one pursues a spiritual path, a driving force, that compels us on our way, and if we choose to walk away from the path, life situations seem to change in order to direct us back. I have brought this up at many workshops, and the heads nodding in agreement, suggest this is quite a common belief, it has also been voiced on here, before.
Where is the free will?
It is a direct contradiction of Gods agreement with mankind, that can only move two ways, 
one, there was no such agreement,
two, the driving force is not of God.




Mojo

[baangus]

I would say it depends on from which perspective, or set of beliefs perhaps, one is examining the question. Say the individual chooses to travel the higher self path, after recognizing the redundant nature of lower self "free will." So what then does the individual experience? That would be my question. Is it complete loss of free will? Or is it an enhanced higher self understanding and sense of responsibility regarding this gift of free will?

My understanding is we have many overlapping karmic threads and soul contracts we work with over a series of lifetimes. And that we pick and choose which of these to work with in each life, and which to leave and work on in another life, and even which put aside altogether and to let go of completely. As I understand it, we are still free beings when it comes to our higher self and karmic responsibilities. The lower plane understanding of the word responsibility is more along the lines of I have been made responsible to carry out this specific task. Responsibility as an assignment you've been given. Whereas the higher plane understanding of what it means to be responsible, is more Recognizing the immensity of this soul gift of free will and, because of that higher understanding, taking greater and conscious care in what I freely choose to be responsible for. Responsibility as a self-chosen moral code.

[sparklekaz]

Hi Robert and Baangus,

I understand the different ways of looking at karma and free will. And still I struggle with the idea that we spend probably many millennia, evolving and learning. To be born each time a 'clean slate'. Scrubbed clean of any previous memory. Yes, we may have the odd dream, or sense of deja vu, but for the most part, we come as empty vessels, ready to be filled once again, by the experiences of 'this' lifetime. Reliant on previous good deeds or lessons learned to help propel us forward on our evolutionary soul path.

I also think that for many of us, we reap what we sow already in this lifetime, in terms of consequences. Do we really have to go through it all again and again and again? You might say, well if you didn't keep on repeating on mistakes, then you wouldn't have too. But my answer to that is, well if I was allowed to remember what it felt like last time, and the harsh lesson I learned from my actions, then I wouldn't keep doing it. I often wonder if someone up there is having a huge joke at our expense.

Seriously though, I think I know what it must feel like to be a hamster in a cage on a little treadmill, that he's unable to get off. Mindlessly, just going around and around and around. I hope when I get to the end of this life, all the things I've learned and come to understand, wont just fly straight out of the window again, when I get 'up there'. Or even better, I can bring it with me, when I come back 'down here'.

The driving force you speak of Robert, I can totally relate to. It is as if I have this magnet inside me, that pulls me forward, whether I want to go or not. Like a bird when its ready for migration, following that invisible line in the air to its destination. I have flown off course a few times, but for the most part, I am where I am. And would I have chosen it if I'd been asked as a young girl, wondering how my life would be. I am sure that I would have said no, more than once. I wonder how many people out there wake up some mornings and ask themselves, how the heck did I get here. There is no doubt there are some incredible moments and we all have learned a lot. But it can be so tough. And onwards we go, no matter what, still moving forward. Pulled by invisible strings!!

Love and light
Kaz

[baangus]

I will say I think karma, and the whole idea of working with karma, is generally misunderstood. We view it (as we do many spiritual concepts) with our comparative "good vs bad" material consciousness. And that can't be helped in many ways, that's how we're taught to examine life questions. Whereas I try to understand these ideas from what I imagine as the perspective of being in it, rather than standing outside looking at it and judging it.

From an "inside it" perspective, there is no such thing as failure for example. When I am in the experience of failure, there is nothing to compare failure to. It is simply the thing I am currently doing, a life lesson. It's the experience I'm having, nothing more or less. It only becomes "failure" if I step outside my immediate experience of the present, to view and compare it in relation to something I did in the past, something that was successful.

I understand karma this same way. My duelistic mind is aware of the concept of "past lives." But I don't stay there in my static thinking, I instead place myself in the living experience of the present. And in the present, all I know is I have life experiences that I deal with, in a variety of ways, depending on the free will choices I make as a soul-spirit being. I don't think about these experiences as being karmic. Rather, my one and only focus is on me, and the degree of conscious consideration I am working with as I deal with life and life questions.

I do not reflect on karma and previous good deeds to give my life happy purpose. I only insure that everything I do, in this moment, is of that honest and truthful "good deed" quality. And that is a choice I make, and a choice I am learning to make with greater clarity each time. I do not give credence to the idea of "bound to my karma," in the same way I don't give credence to the idea of "God as the driving force that equates to relinquishing free will." I am, in this moment; that is the always and forever of material existence. And I am free. I am not bound by karma or predestined purpose. The soul journey is a journey and not a destination, and how about that for ripping off a well-known saying!

[mojomojo]

Hi all,

Nothing in life, is either good or bad, it is thinking that makes it so.

Not thinking, might make life acceptable, it also leaves us with all our defences down.

Where we connect with something mightier than our limited mind, who knows what is better for us, though it may not seem like it at the time.

Why is it necessary, this complete surrender, of the logical mind.

We would not put this reasoning into effect in any other aspect of life.


Mojo.