my noodle was baked (not just once)

[donq]

You might recall the following quote (from The Matrix, 1999) between Oracle and Neo:

Oracle : I'd ask you to sit down, but, you're not going to anyway. And don't worry about the vase.
Neo : What vase?
[Neo turns to look for a vase, and as he does, he knocks over a vase of flowers, which shatters on the floor]
Oracle : That vase.
Neo : I'm sorry...
Oracle : I said don't worry about it. I'll get one of my kids to fix it.
Neo : How did you know?
Oracle : Ohh, what's really going to bake your noodle later on is, would you still have broken it if I hadn't said anything?
Even the first time I watched the movie, this very dialogue was so impressed me. You have to understand that even that time I already had been into "foreknowledge" or "the concept of knowledge regarding future events" via spiritual practice, and especially via I Ching or the book of changes, more than a decade. And I did learn that the future was not destined. It changes every moment depending on what exactly we do at this particularly moment (you might familiar with the "butterfly effect" from the movies).
Anyway, back to the above quote, after I consulted I Ching with some question and got the warning that, "your initial judgments are quite misleading".
I respected that warning and tried to be more open-minded and did something I never considered it before.
Well, I found out later that what I just did, turned out to be my "initial judgment" and was wrong. lol
So, the question was, that warning was really true because it did happen as it said? (though it happened just because I believed it). But what if I didn't know that warning, or didn't believe it, did it still happen that way?

[hera]

I smiled while reading this as it's something I often wonder about my astrological musings.
Do I 'make' things happen because I see the portents in the stars or would they have happened anyway?

Actually I believe they would have happened anyway, as too often I have decided astrology has too much influence over the way I feel and live and turn my back on it, then something major happens, I check the transits and lo and behold there it is - the meaningful transits to me and my chart that show the influence that 'caused' it to happen.

[mojomojo]

For me, we do come into this life, with a basic frame of a predestined life plan, but as has already been stated, that is influenced by our every thought and action.
If a prediction of something unfortunate came about, for another person, and you did not warn them, and this misfortune came true,[ no prior warning].
If they had been warned, and it was well within their control to do something about it, and the misfortune still came about [predestined].
What was the purpose of the person receiving the warning?

[donq]

Dear Hera and Robert,

First of all, let me thank both of you, from my heart, for this warm-heart conversation. I really feel alive again. Descartes said, "I think, therefore I am" but I might be in worse case, "I think, therefore I write, and so I am." (I've been earning my living as a writer for almost 30 years now. But I didn't always can write what I really wanted to if my editors stopped me with the reason, it never be sold. Well, a man had to eat, right? And idealism doesn't full your stomach; but food does, right?

Okay, back to this thread:

Hera said,

"Do I 'make' things happen because I see the portents in the stars or would they have happened anyway?
"Actually I believe they would have happened anyway, as too often I have decided astrology has too much influence over the way I feel and live and turn my back on it, then something major happens, I check the transits and lo and behold there it is - the meaningful transits to me and my chart that show the influence that 'caused' it to happen."

-You know what my first impression that made me keep studying I Ching for more than 30 years now? (I own more than 80 versions of its translations). I got some answer after asking some question. Then, my brain wanted to outsmart it, and immediately asked the same question again. Yes, you can guess what I got:

YOUTHFUL FOLLY has success.
It is not I who seek the young fool;
The young fool seeks me.
At the first oracle I inform him.
If he asks two or three times, it is importunity.
If he importunes, I give him no information.

(Well, I always knew that everyone is sensitive. But that time I just learned that even I Ching was, too).

After keep studying it for 35 years or so, I think I understand how it works (Hmm...or this will be my initial judgments again?). Let me brief it here.
Ancient men of wisdom had noticed that water went down (ward), air went up etc. This time of the year, we felt hot, that time cold. When the moon was full, the water flew, (after ebb) etc. And the same as in astrology, when this and that star appeared in that and that position of the sky, there were such and such events happened in the human world. So men of wisdom wrote them down all.
As for I Ching, it also works like an alcohol detector or even lies detector. I asked a question and got that exact answer (after I tossed coins or picked the yellow stalks) because I had that exact state of mind (conscious and unconscious) at that very exact moment. It's kind of body and mind (conscious and unconscious) connection. More than that, it helped me to do my honest self-critique. Wherether its warning would come true or not, I always could learn about myself more and more. Here's some of its wise words:

"You can also begin to understand the path you should follow by recognizing how the consequences of your actions return to affect you. Every
choice you make affects the world around you, and every action you take in the world has a reaction in your own life. What kind of feedback are you getting from your environment when you act in a certain way? If your habits work to make you feel healthier, happier, and more confident about yourself, you are probably headed in the right direction. But if your patterns of behavior repeatedly leave you feeling unhappy, lonely empty, and despairing, something is amiss."

.................................

Mojo said, "If they had been warned, and it was well within their control to do something about it, and the misfortune still came about [predestined].
"What was the purpose of the person receiving the warning?"

-Great question!
I kind of agree (learned by bitter experiences in the past) with Hera when she said she believed they would have happened anyway. And as you asked, what the purpose of the warning was, then?
I believe it's about scope of learning? I mean, the warning made us to prepare something in advance. And if we failed to do that, at least, we can learn from our mistakes more easily than knowing nothing at all. If I got a warning in advance that it would rain, at least, I could bring my umbrella with me. It was better to have no umbrella when I really needed it. And if I went out without knowing that warning or didn’t believe in it, I would feel so terrible in the rain.

But that thing really happened because that warning (like in Neo's case above)? I mean we just made it happened because of ourselves, because of our self-fulfilling prophecy (the socio-psychological phenomenon of someone "predicting" or expecting something, and this “prediction” or expectation comes true simply because one believes it will)?
Hmm...I don't think so. The warning didn’t/couldn’t make the rain fall. Neither did I. Right?

Besides if we can make believe in anything, why thinks cannot always be like we believe/wish. For example, no matter how hard I tried to make my self-fulfilling prophecy that I would win a lottery this time, it never happened. I even tried another way round, that I would never won lottery, well, just in case I could break this spell, I still never won it.

Oh! or did this self-fulfilling prophecy really work, just only in the negative way?

[mojomojo]

Every now and then, I ask spirit for something to come into my experience, only small things, just as a way of seeing if Iam in tune. It has never failed, but one thing I have noticed, it always answers in a way, that is spiritual, in that, if it is in alignment with what my higher self deems necessary for my growth.
If I ask to win money, I doubt it will come my way, apart from the fact, I may have a poverty mindset buried in my subconscious,
but I have never had much interest in the material.
If I ask for something spiritual, I know without doubt it will happen.
Which reminds me of one which happened lately, I have a small vinyl lp collection and a vintage turntable which sounds fantastic, but prices of old vinyl is going up these days, so I asked spirit, for a vinyl lp collection to come up for sale at a reasonable price. Many weeks later we were in London at my wife's, uncles funeral. I had only met this man three times, but I liked him, mainly because he was very down to earth.
With the funeral over we returned home, several weeks passed, the wife of the man who had passed visited my wife and in their general chit chat, this woman commented she was getting rid of some of her husbands stuff. She had two large suitcases full of old vinyl lps, none of the children wanted them. when she heard I had an interest, that was it, no questions asked, I was getting the whole lot, and she was delighted about it. Again I emphasize, I have only met these people three times.
That is the most material thing spirit has ever sent my way, but going back to my original comment, it has to be in alignment with your higher purpose, music does soothe the soul and raise the vibration level.

Mojo.

[hera]

Reading your reply Mojo reminded me with a great deal of surprised pleasure of something that happened just this weekend.

Since the forum was last active I have become involved in a complicated LDR (we are on opposite sides of the Atlantic) with a man I love very much.
As mentioned however, it a complicated relationship and has had difficulties. On Friday evening I reached a point where I had to make a decision about whether to continue or not and asked spirit/God/whatever name you assign to your higher self to give me clear guidance about what I should do.
The next day I turned on the laptop and clicked on a podcast that I wasn't really interested in - which begs the question why did I click on it - and the vid started for some reason several minutes into the recording. The person talking was speaking about something that wasn't connected to my situation but did immediately give me a clear answer as to what my decision should be; it was one of those 'light bulb moments' we have from time to time.

I had forgotten that I had asked for guidance until reading your post, so thanks for sharing your story Mojo and reminding me that help was offered when I asked for it.

[mojomojo]

How was it put in the past,
ASK, WAIT, LISTEN AND RECEIVE.

These experiences can be very powerful and personal; and leave no doubt in the recipients mind, there is something far more powerful than ourselves at play, but be careful what you ask for, sometimes we can bite off more than we can chew.

Mojo.