Do the evil ones go to heaven.

[mojomojo]

Hi all, I have been reading through the forum, and came across a thread, where someone was discussing if those that did evil got away with it, as, in if there was no judgement, no accountability. Often, thought about it myself, but in thinking that, are we looking for retribution, we just want someone else to carry it out, or do we go more, every deed, action, thought is accounted, and determines what we receive in life, or accumulate for ourselves in the next. Then, there is the idea, that there is no right or wrong as such, life is evolving, just some are a little bit more in the shade than others, even though the commit massive atrocities, or do we take it that a judgement day will come, and the good will be separated from the bad, and each will meet his just end.



Sorry, for all the posts, but I have been laid up with my back for the last week, and spend my time coming on here irritating you folk.










Day of judgement, GOD is calling,
Underneath, the war pigs crawling,
Begging mercy for their sin's,
Satan, laughing, spreads his wings.

[tribunalofmercy]

I hope you are getting better every day, Mojo! Hah, not so you will go Away but so you will Feel better



I don't blame people One Bit for feeling more than just "angry" with those who have taken Everything from them in some way by doing Harm to them: by taking away loved ones or friends, possessions, hope, trust, dignity...everything we truly Possess here in this life can potentially be "taken away" by others...

I will not address this one in (my usual) depth but will leave you with just a few thoughts:



Personally, within my life-experience, I have no ability to hate others. I have been raped, beaten, shot at, abandoned, lost family and loved ones to violent crime; I still have Zero ability to hold that, in my Heart, against those who perpetrated the crimes, though I would Not that those who do so be allowed to run Rampant, with no consequence.


I do believe that all come from Source, and all ultimately return to Source, so my views of "hell" have changed....


I know that from the moment of true Awareness, one also becomes aware of Every "past" action, every thought, that has been part of our life-experience prior to that awakening or awareness, and the sheer Understanding of what we have done can potentially Destroy us, just by that knowledge...


I Firmly believe, within the paradox that is both Free Will and Predestination according to Sacred, Universal Law, that Each of us has a responsibility to do Our part within our own life-equations to balance all Other, and that if Everyone did so we would find the Whole a much easier - and possibly Clearer - experience to live within.



Love and Wisdom,

Mary Anne

[Ishtahota]

In the Gospel of Philip which is not in the Bible that most read. Jesus and Philip were talking, Philip asked about hell. Jesus told him that there was no such as we think of it, and in the end we all will go to what they called Heaven. Heaven and Hell, reward and punishment, good and evil is a product of our duality consciousness. Truth be known we all go to hell first as soon as we die. It is the in-between world of the astral. Going into the light is a choice that we all must make for ourselves.

Judgement is something that we all go through daily. "Judge not least yea also be judged." We see this phrase being played out all of the time and we do not see it for what it really is. If I cannot forgive someone for what they have done, then I have made a judgement. And the only way that I can truly forgive is by understanding another persons point of view. Our higher-self makes the judgement, and our sub-conscious carries that judgement out. Then the day comes when spirit removes the blinders from our eyes and we realize that are treating someone else as we were treated by the person that we could not forgive. How many abused children grow up to pedophiles and abusers themselves?

True forgiveness can only come from understanding, and understanding sometimes can only be done from direct experience. We judge ourselves almost daily.

[gruntal]

As to rather the evil ones can go to Heaven the answer of course is no because evil can not experience Heaven. Or know what Heaven is. This had nothing to do with judgement even as moral rules are too hard to define to make them practicable as mundane instruments of justice.

As we mature we see things more or differently and then cause and effect come into play. So it is not so much what we can do to go to Heaven ( or not ) as it is what we have done to make ourselves whole. Sort of like dangling your foot in the water and wondering what you cant be a porpoise. You have to shed the arms and legs first plus some other changes and then becoming a porpoise is automatic. The rest just don porpoise costumes and chant like a porpoise and think that will suffice. They also eat lots of sardines and presume having "fishy" breath will help but we all know that is a joke on them ...

[mojomojo]

You people, never cease to amaze me with your open, honesty and wisdom, I thank you both for the privilege of meeting you.
Mary Anne, can I thank you for your journal entry, you posted, it was very capturing, are you an author?

Again, many thanks, Mojo.

[mojomojo]

Hi Gruntal, thank you for your wise words, I love your analogy of a porpoise.

[aceofcups]

Mojo,,, if your laid up in bed why don't you join us in the chat room on site sometimes.

[mojomojo]

Hi Ace, thanks for the invite, thought , I would try to get to know a few people first, plus my keyboard skills, are not that quick, you might have all left before I get a sentence in. I will get around to it, you have a great community here, very good people,
Many thanks,
Mojo.

[tribunalofmercy]

You'd be surprised how Talkative we are over there (or not) (feel free, Mojo)

MA

[lionl]

Oct 24, 2014 15:52:45 GMT Ishtahota said:

     Going into the light is a choice that we all must make for ourselves.

I agree with this.

To me, God is pure love.  He/She/It would never reject any one of us.  However, our shame at what we've done in our lives, our feelings of unworthiness or our self-judgement might make us fearful of going into the light.

Regarding 'paying' for our actions - I personally think that we experience the life of everyone and everything and so we will feel any pain and suffering we have caused, whether to human or animal.  Another reason why it's best to have as little fear or pain as possible in the world.

My two penn'orth.

[mojomojo]

Hi Lionl, very well put, if we could only master ourselves, so that we could enter and leave the water without creating a ripple.

[alvinw3]

I believe in reincarnation and karma, the evil ones and even the good Souls get judged by the lord of karma on the Astra.plane. We all have our book of life records that the Lord of karma reads, thereal bad ones go to a reformatory were they stay until they reform some what and get reborn to the same plane were the created there bad karma to work it off, the good ones even if they have a little bad karma have to work it off on the plane the created it but dont stay on the Astral plane for very long, the bad ones and most other Souls are on the Wheel of eighty four, which is 8 million four hundred thousen years, after which some of the physical universe is destroyed because the resorses have run out and the Souls that didnt mak it are put to sleep till God reshapes the planets and it starts all over again, reincarnation is a form of punishment acording to being in heaven, it is true that every Soul will make it to heaven but some of them take alittle longer, and the ones that find the Godman because of there good karma, works off ther bad karma more rappedly so they dont have to meet the lord of karma, and are guided by the Godman to the first heaven

[Bartholomew]

Once created nothing is ever lost. It is not logical to blame the soul for the shortcomings of the Earth bound personality. The soul merely expresses through the physical body. It is a life wholly separate in many other ways. It is eternal. The body is temporal and finite. So what happens when a man misbehaves during a lifetime? He dies and is called to account. He is not punished. He is made to realize his errors and since he now is thinking with soul mind instead of Earthly personality mind he immediately understands all of this. It is not God that judges. It is the man himself, with the help of his guide. We all judge ourselves. We are much more severe than God would ever be.

Whether or not evil exists is a matter of perspective. From the vantage point of the Earth it certainly does. From the buddhic plane of existence it does not. The business of a human soul is to grow and evolve spiritually so that eventually it gains enough wisdom so that it no longer is required to connect to the Earth through human beings. Yes. A man lives once but a soul uses thousands of Earthly bodies/personalities in it's quest for perfection. This is the way it works. So in a sense reincarnation is false but it is true at the same time. It's all in the understanding of what it is.

A soul, on it's own plane of existence, the high mental plane, is not capable of any sort of violence. Souls are not competitive nor are they interested in gaining advantages over others. But when a man on Earth incurs a debt it is the soul which is responsible. What happens is that when a soul is intent upon clearing up a burden it will project itself to Earth again selecting a setting in which the opportunity for such action is possible. And a new baby is born somewhere that will eventually work to pay the debt incurred by an earlier personality. This may seem unfair but it is not. Again it depends on perspective. This is the probable reason for someone being born with a terrible defect for instance. In order to understand this we have to stop being personality centric. Most of us are not aware of our souls and so have a hard time doing this. We get the idea that our present personalities, the "me" is eternal and that the soul is just a part of it. This is not true. The soul is neither a part of nor is it subservient to the personality. There is nothing a man on Earth can do which will result in anything like eternal damnation.

Each personality on Earth is a temporary agent of a soul. Even the soul which projected itself as Hitler will eventually be cleansed and returned to Godliness. This is the true meaning of "unconditional and eternal love", of "unlimited forgiveness" that we are told God is. So debts incurred on Earth are paid on Earth. It is the business of the soul to make sure this happens.

Is this confusing? Well it certainly is contrary to Christian teachings. In fact I do not speak from any religious viewpoint. The reason is because religions are things of the Earth only. There are none in the spirit world which is our true and eternal home.

Blessings to us all...

[chris86]

Just a thought here, but if nobody will stand up and bring forward judgment day, isnt evil going to get away with those evil deeds, and how would evil know that they need healing also, one would be too busy and caught up in thier own business.

Heaven or hell would only be a projection projected onto them, so i guess evil might only think about heaven, and also think about hell too, though would anyone wish heaven lifts someone out of a pittyfull hole, or do we only care about ourselves and not notice others that pine away, then again all this evil could be just an illusion, creation of our own minds, laughable now its only a memory, if we are aware its of the minds creation, so how are we to know if one has not gone to heaven?

Everyone thinks about heaven differently, maybe we all have been to heaven, though no memory of it doesnt mean we have not been there, simply by not knowing we cannot be or have been in heaven?

[Bartholomew]

Mar 8, 2015 10:55:13 GMT chris86 said:

Just a thought here, but if nobody will stand up and bring forward judgment day, isnt evil going to get away with those evil deeds, and how would evil know that they need healing also, one would be too busy and caught up in thier own business.

Heaven or hell would only be a projection projected onto them, so i guess evil might only think about heaven, and also think about hell too, though would anyone wish heaven lifts someone out of a pittyfull hole, or do we only care about ourselves and not notice others that pine away, then again all this evil could be just an illusion, creation of our own minds, laughable now its only a memory, if we are aware its of the minds creation, so how are we to know if one has not gone to heaven?

Everyone thinks about heaven differently, maybe we all have been to heaven, though no memory of it doesnt mean we have not been there, simply by not knowing we cannot be or have been in heaven?

Evil will never get away with anything.   When thinking about "evil" substitute "humans misbehaving" and see that through their foul deeds that we all, them included sooner or later, learn.  God made the Earth for precisely that reason.  If "evil" was non-existent sending souls to live here would be without purpose.  God allows it for good reason.   Only here on Earth are there harmful things.  Although each man has a soul it is the personality which errs only.  Souls are incapable of that sort of thing.  But they have to learn so while on Earth God allows it.  

There are no loose ends.  Every single misdeed and harmful action is answered in kind even if the perpetrator dies before that time.  And those of us who witness such things have the opportunity to learn humility, patience and wisdom from them.  The justice of God is infallible.

[chris86]

Thanks bartholomew, i dont know much about evil, though we see it in movies and is always set in a religious theme, so i guess there is some work going on there, evil can go to heaven maybe, though through understanding if that makes sense?

[Bartholomew]

Mar 9, 2015 18:02:48 GMT chris86 said:

Thanks bartholomew, i dont know much about evil, though we see it in movies and is always set in a religious theme, so i guess there is some work going on there, evil can go to heaven maybe, though through understanding if that makes sense?

By "heaven" we usually mean "the spirit world"   Viewing heaven as a structured arrangement in spirit where the higher one goes the more purified are the beings that are found we realize that "evil" cannot be raised very high at all.  In fact evil cannot leave the Earth.  There is no evil beyond the astral plane except that those who wield it do have somewhat higher access.  Here I refer to the lower mental plane which is used by all of humanity (for good or ill). The Satan of Jews, Christians and Muslims is not any sort of high "angel" who went bad.  We will never meet this entity in heaven.  Only the memory of it can be found.  Evil is restricted to the lower the lower planes.  This is another good reason to avoid the astral plane in meditations.  Evil and deception does exist there. 

Be assured of one thing.  On the plane of souls (our real "heaven"), our true home, there is NO evil.

There's more.

When you ask about evil going to heaven you may be talking about the souls of those who do evil here on Earth.  No need to mention names.  The answer is twofold.  First "going to heaven" is a phrase which misleads.  Only souls are found in heaven and they never leave in the first place.  They do not go to Earth to join with a body/personality....   They simply connect to it via a thread of energy.   This thread is made of a tiny bit of soul energy.  Think of it as though it were a remote control device.  After the body dies the thread is withdrawn.  It is this action which is so often reported by those who died but came back.  They were "pulled" (into the light).  During a life on Earth a small bit of soul consciousness is connected to the Earth body.  When this is withdrawn the man who is passing  feels the action and may say that "I went to heaven". 

Even the very worst man who ever lived has a soul in heaven.   The soul does not leave that place no matter what the personality does.  Remember that souls are not good or bad.  There is no such duality in heaven.  Is such a soul punished?  No.  The soul whose projection was involved with evil while on Earth will expend a lot of time and energy in neutralizing those actions.  During this time the progress of the soul is diverted.  In addition it will be required that future incarnations (bodies and personalities of that soul) will pay retribution on Earth where the crimes were committed.  Thus we occasionally see what we call injustices.   Are they really?  In order to judge we have to go to a very high place.

From our viewpoint on Earth all this can seem perplexing and complicated.  From the plane of souls it is not.  Can we begin to understand why religions do not delve too deeply into such matters.  Their primary concern is to provide guidance to us while we are alive.   It is much simpler and just as effective for a religion to speak in terms of obedience or else...   They cannot be blamed tor this.  They tell us what we need to hear.  There is no need for a man to leave a religion in which he is happy and comfortable.

Blessings to us all.

[Barry]

The kingdom of heaven is in our hearts not in the sky

Barry